Stainbrook cited, states it was politically motivated
I heard about this earlier today and did verify through the Toledo Clerk of Court that charges were filed, but waited until media reports were available for more details. The Toledo Free Press has the story online as well as the Blade, that Jon Stainbrook was cited last night for failure to disclose personal information and obstructing official business. Police issued Stainbrook a citation and released him, he’s scheduled to appear in court later this month.
The Toledo Free Press article contains a statement provided to Fox News:
“Clearly this incident is politically motivated. It’s not a coincidence that I am being harassed by the police at the same time I’m mounting a challenge to the status quo of the Lucas County Republican Party. The charges will be proven to be ‘trumped up.’ ”
The Blade article states:
“I didn’t think it was a big thing. This was nothing. It was a routine traffic stop,” Mr. Stainbrook said. “I was trying not to talk on a cell phone when we were driving. I told Meghan I needed a pen and she pulled over to get me a pen, that’s all this was. It seemed more like a misunderstanding.”
WTOL states:
Police say the back window was fogged over. When Stainbrook got out of the car, his belt was undone. At that point, police say he would only talk to Toledo police.
Clearly Stainbrook is ready to lead the party of Larry Craig! The blade forgot to mention the steamy windows and unbuckled belt. I have to wonder where his girlfriend was looking for the pen!
April 24th, 2008 at 4:20 pmSo was stainbrook in a hummer or was he getting a hummer?
April 24th, 2008 at 4:42 pmHe is “being harassed” by the police. First and foremost, had he not harassed the cop about being a UT cop, then maybe this wouldn’t even be a story. Duh! Im no cop, but I figure that most incidents like this the person would be given a warning (since no one was drinking) and have a good night. Wow, great work political activist.
April 24th, 2008 at 4:59 pmEver since I found out Jon Stainbrook cavorted with JRBlock at a Mud Hens game, the bottom of his credibility factor dropped out in my book.
Even tho I personally feel that he was being screwed by Ms Wack, I think I am beginning to understand her convoluted logic in preventing Stainbrook from achieving power.
Dude, and your belt buckle was undone? And you’re going to use “she was reaching for a pen” while she was behind the wheel and you were in the passenger seat with closer access to the glove box?
Jon, do you really think we, as a community, are more stupider than you, really?
April 24th, 2008 at 5:30 pmJon,
You be dead meat…..bye, bye…..
April 24th, 2008 at 5:37 pmMaybe he was reaching for a pen, maybe he was on the phone, maybe they were just having a bit of fun, maybe he was reliving high school memories. I’m not going to pretend I never was in a parked car with steamed up windows.
Sure he could have just given the UT officer his identification and it probably would have ended there, but? I don’t think he’s dead meat Tom, this is after all Toledo.
No drugs, no sex with under-age minors…a temporary embarrassment that might affect the upcoming party elections but not a full blown scandal.
April 24th, 2008 at 5:45 pmNow Lisa, in another thread I said there was something funny about the looks of this guy, now didn’t I?
April 24th, 2008 at 6:17 pm# 1 meghan Says:
April 24th, 2008 at 4:20 pm
“Clearly Stainbrook is ready to lead the party of Larry Craig! The blade forgot to mention the steamy windows and unbuckled belt. I have to wonder where his girlfriend was looking for the pen!”
Maybe the pen is so small it takes getting your head up over it, to find it.
April 24th, 2008 at 6:20 pmGuys, please don’t venture that low below the belt line…next you’ll be expecting me to blog about men who believe witchcraft made their penis shrink or disappear.
April 24th, 2008 at 6:23 pmPolitically motivated? I hate to deliver another “blow” to Mr. Stainbrook’s ego, but neither of the police officers nor 99.99% of the people in Lucas County have a clue who he is.
April 24th, 2008 at 7:01 pm…giving a whole new meaning to “The Stain.”
April 24th, 2008 at 7:11 pmI bet John McCain will be happy to have this guy in his corner in battleground state Ohio.
April 24th, 2008 at 7:16 pm# 11 Stain’d Says:
…giving a whole new meaning to “The Stain.”
Oh yea, I get it, tee hee. I mean, yuck!
April 24th, 2008 at 7:27 pmNow that I have read the Balde and free press pieces, I think it is safe to say, that “The stain” will soon get his cumupance.
April 24th, 2008 at 7:41 pmI cannot remember a time in my life when so much has been written about a guy who has done so little. Perhaps he can find the rock that he crawled out from under and retreat. Truly amazing and here I am adding to it. Shame on me!
April 24th, 2008 at 9:21 pmNow Lisa I did say in another thread that this stain character had a funny look to him. As I recall, you said he seemed like a normal good looking guy? Remember that?
April 24th, 2008 at 9:29 pmI don’t blame him, I wouldn’t show my identification to anything but a police officer with jurisdiction in that area: the corner of heatherdowns and birchwood is pretty far from the campus at MCO/UT. Officers can’t just stop anyone, anywhere. What was an on-duty UT cop doing so far off campus, that is what i’m wondering.
April 24th, 2008 at 9:29 pmcum clean. Oops oxymoron.
April 24th, 2008 at 9:31 pmMy questions is….
Was she wearing a blue dress?
April 24th, 2008 at 9:34 pm# 17 pierce Says:
“Officers can’t just stop anyone, anywhere.”
I agree with the other stuff. But weren’t they stopped, already, on a busy street, will she was trying to locate his pen?
April 24th, 2008 at 9:35 pmwhile
April 24th, 2008 at 9:36 pmI checked on Areis, the property is owned by the Medical College University which makes it part of the University of Toledo and that is why UT officers were patrolling…So he was not out of his area.
Not Again, if he was truly parking in car with a female friend, that doesn’t have anything to do with his looks.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:00 pm# 17 pierce Says:
“Officers can’t just stop anyone, anywhere.”
If you heard or saw the news they were in front of Heatherdowns School, which houses some offices and programs for the UT Med. program (or something to that fact, drive by the school and you will see a sign reflecting that) So, being parked 4 feet off the curb in front of a University building, campus police were in the right-of-way to question the people in the car. So John is still an idiot!
April 24th, 2008 at 10:02 pmwell if an officer out of his jurisdiction taps on the window of your stopped car, you need not open the window let allow produce identification. So in that, he did nothing wrong, but the reaction in this string of comments is evidence enough of the witch hunt that is out for this guy. I’m no Jon Stainbrook fan, and never have been (except when I was able to drink underage at the club he owned in the 90s) but really this is ridiculous.
Do people really think he would do this at the intersection of a well traveled road? This is a few blocks from a big, unlit park… several big box establishment with dark, hidden loading docks…. this mob mentality (not to mention really unfunny puns) is quite boorish
April 24th, 2008 at 10:05 pmok i read Doug’s comment after posting that, thanks for clarifying.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pmWhen I was at UT for my freshman orientation, they said that UT police officers are fully deputized and can pull you over for anything a city officer can do. They are paid by UT so they obviously are going to hand around UT mostly.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pmAnd that means they can pull you over on any city road.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:07 pmthe point myself and lisa just made pierce was that they were in the jurisdiction of the campus. And when you read the university police officers account of the incident, which my friend Meghan has a copy of, John explained to the UTPD that because a girl was shot by a UTPD years ago, he was not gonna produce his identification to a UTPD officer. Beyond that, the proper procedure if you are not comfortable with the officer that taps on your window, you are to identify that fact and don’t tell stories or run your mouth.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:12 pmsorry pierce, I started writing before I saw your posting
April 24th, 2008 at 10:13 pmPierce, I don’t disagree that some of the comments are ones I would not have written personally but I think it’s going to be very difficult for Jon to prove this was politically motivated. It would entail a UT police officer to have known that he was in Meghan’s car, and recognized him by sight alone when in Jon’s words as quoted he refused to provide identification to the UT officer. Had he provided identification, the reality is we would probably not even know that this whole incident happened.
From a constitutional issue should a passenger be forced to identify themselves is an interesting topic to consider, unfortunately with the way the law is set up in Ohio you do have to provide identification on demand even if you are not the driver.
April 24th, 2008 at 10:20 pmI posted a copy of the police report.
http://swampbubbles.com/stainbrook-police-report-and-story
April 24th, 2008 at 10:24 pmAnd – for the record – the officers of the UT Police department are certified peace officers in the state of Ohio with full arrest powers, so the idea that they might have been “outside their territory” is moot. Stainbrook should have shown the UT officers the same respect as is due the officers of Toledo, Ottawa Hills, or any other jurisdiction.
And the idea that his run-in is “politically motivated” is a hilarious piece of fiction, though not as funny nor as far-fetched as his earlier claims that he and Joe Kidd were the John Dean and Deep Throat of Coingate.
These two cowered when given the opportunity by the Free Press in 2005 to go public, and they only came forward with their story after the Wenzel story broke in Salon.com and Editor&Publisher, long after it was safe and Tom Noe was in leg chains.
Some heroes, huh?
I should know. I’m the sucker to whom Stainbrook pitched the Wenzel-Noe coverup story in June 2005, only to watch Stainbrook and Kidd cave in and reneg on their earlier promises of going on record when they had their chance to tell what they supposedly knew.
I wasted about 100 hours of my time on this idiot and his wild-ass tales, so I have a reason to be skeptical of anything that comes out of his mouth.
I’ve been quiet about this for almost three years, but I recently learned that Stainbrook identified me in a lawsuit against TFP as a “pizza delivery driver” who assisted the Free Press in obtaining his book proposal.
For the record: I have never seen the book proposal, and I was never involved in any scheme to forward it to TFP.
Oh, but I did deliver pizzas in 2003 rather than let my family go hungry. I also waited tables from 2001-2002, and even worked some crappy factory jobs over the years. Maybe Jon could put that in his bullshit lawsuit, too.
Oh – what is especially funny about Stainbrook’s lame attempt to discredit me is that I interviewed the schmuck at the Maumee River Yacht Club. No, he was not hobnobbing with Toledo’s elite, folks. He was the farking poolboy, and he had to interrupt our interview several times to check the chlorine levels after some yacht club member whined about how her daughter’s eyes were burning.
You know, I think truth really is stranger than fiction.
:-}
April 24th, 2008 at 10:32 pmJon Stainbrook should just go away. It shows what bad shape the County GOP is in that he was viewed as a viable Party Chairman. Please no more stories on this loser.
April 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pmHistoryMike, I didn’t realize you were dragged into the lawsuit, and as former Taco Bell worker? Pizza delivery guys rock.
April 24th, 2008 at 11:28 pmMike-
April 25th, 2008 at 9:32 amThe stain is only viewed as a viable candidate for chairman in his own mind and the blade. He is a “legend in his own mind”, that phrase was coined in the stain’s honor. Some may view the stain as more of a stain on society. Or in this case a stain on a dress!
The Ohio Supreme Court has upheld the right of an officer of the law to request not only the I.D. of the driver but also of any passenger in the car, including the back seat. Check out the arrest report. If Stainbrook and this woman live together as his friends have reported on air, how is it that they have two different addresses? Enquiring minds want to know.
April 25th, 2008 at 9:43 amConsidering the stain is friends with blockhead, that concerns me. The blocks are weird people.
Historymike, thanks for the insight.
April 25th, 2008 at 12:39 pmWhat happened to innocent until proven guilty? I personally believe that there was nothing sexual going on. With as much scrutiny as Stainbrook is always under and as much as he would like to lead the Republican party here in Lucas county, I don’t believe he would do anything to jeopordize his oppprotunity. I also believe he does care about the greater Toledo area and at least he tries to improve it instead of moving away.
Royal Barber, III
April 25th, 2008 at 1:41 pmHe was not charged with any sex crimes, Mr. Royal Barber.
He was charged for his refusal to cooperate with a police officer.
You have never met ‘the Stain’, have you ?
He is truly a man in his own world. I think it had something to do with overindulgences in the 70’s.
April 25th, 2008 at 2:04 pmWell many of the comments here imply that it was a sexual rendevous. As far as not giving his information to a UT officer, I probably wouldn’t have either. Since I know nothing about the UT police, I would have assumed they were nothing more than a gereric security guard and probably would have asked for the Toledo Police to be called. My Social Security number and personal information is on my drivers license and I don’t show that to anybody without good cause.
Royal Barber, III
April 25th, 2008 at 2:14 pmRoyal Barber, the only thing you need to know is that — by the police report — Stainbrook refused to obey the law. And that should concern you. What should further concern you is Stainbrook’s arrogance and ignorance, which gave him “license” to disobey that law.
And for the record:
1. Parked car.
2. Night.
3. Fogged up windows.
4. Irritable occupants.
5. Undone trousers.
… EQUALS sexual activity. You may not care about that, and really neither do I, but at least I don’t live in denial about what Stainbrook was doing.
April 25th, 2008 at 2:22 pmAnd furthermore, only an idiot would believe the excuse of “impersonating a police officer”. In fact, on the police report (read: EVIDENCE) Stainbrook used TWO excuses. He also said that he didn’t see the officer’s uniform. That’s even more filled with BULLSHIT since the driver obviously believed the officer. Multiple and illogical excuses EQUAL lying, Lying, LYING.
RB, stop making excuses for Mr. Staineddress. He was wrong to do what he did when he refused to identify himself, and if you had done the same, then you’d have the SAME court date and the SAME lack of justification for your defense.
April 25th, 2008 at 2:29 pmI know nothing about this man. All I know is whenever his picture appeared in the daily rag he always looked creepy. He has a smug look about him.
April 25th, 2008 at 2:31 pmFurthermore yet, Stainbrook’s claims of “politically motivated” must have been taken from the “Tom Noe Handbook”. I was so proud of Noe’s blatant lies that I kept the TFP issue (with Tom’s fat, lying face on the cover, remember”
with his so-called interview. Stainbrook had better put down Tom’s beloved handbook and ditch Tom’s lying ways, before he gets into even more trouble with the electorate and judge. Does Stainbrook believe we lack sufficient Republicans in this area, so he’s somehow irreplaceable? Even if he believes that, I say “fuck no”. Maybe we could get Denis Katell to replace his sorry ass.
P.S. Where are you, Denis?
April 25th, 2008 at 2:33 pmI have been a long time local Republican supporter up until last year. I sat back and thought long and hard about what I believed. I chose to go with what I believed. I believe in strong conservative beliefs. This is something that has been missing from the local party leadership for a long time now. I chose to support John and still do. (Please do not stop reading yet!) This whole “scandal” with the UT police and John not giving up his ID. I probably would have done the same thing. The reason being is until today, I thought that the UT police only had jurisdiction on the campus and surrounding streets. I was would probably not have been aware that the building he was parked at would have been UT property. (I am not condoning the comments he made and I am disappointed in those comments). Now knowing that there was a street lamp right above the car and hearing the statements made by all parties, I personally think that there was nothing sexual going on in the vehicle. All of this being said, I do still believe in John and believe he could still be a great chairman. Everyone deserves a second chance, and with the number of chances that we have already given our current local republican leaders, I think we all owe it to John. Have a great day and enjoy ripping me a new one on here!!
April 25th, 2008 at 3:22 pmStaindress is looking more and more like a paranoid schizophrenic. With statements to the police like: I went to UT when that girl was killed by a UT police officer…..
Wow! He just basically threw the entire UT police force under the bus as still being suspect. I think he is lucky that he was released without spending the night in jail!
And Royal Barber, you must be the same one who called Fred’s show this morning. Nice of you to share Stain’s temperment with the audience. I wonder if the Republican party is still interested in a chairman who has a bad temper and trouble getting along with others and who is so stubborn! I would think that more of a people person would be an appropriate chairman since there is an awful lot of handshaking to do! What is it exactly that makes him qualified to be chairman? Oh yeah – must be that sparkling personality!
April 25th, 2008 at 3:22 pmSo One Eye Guy – What is it that our current Republican leaders have done that is so very awful?
April 25th, 2008 at 3:26 pmOh, must be that darn Tom Noe running the party from his prison cell.
Do you even know anyone involved with the R party besides Stain? Have you given them a first chance or is it just Stain who deserves a second?
Meghan,
I am referring to Joanne Wack bouncing checks and not making them correct. I am talking about Doug Haynem’s assault record, Dennis Lang’s tax evasion, and Bob Reichart’s DUI. I am not just talking about Tom Noe. Tom Noe is in prison paying for what he had done. I am talking about current leadership that we have given second chances to.
I response to your second question I was very involved with the Lucas County Republican Party as well as the Young Republicans. I was the Vice President of the Toledo Young Republicans, Regional Vice Chairman of the Ohio Young Republicans and Co-Chairman to the Resolutions Committee for the Young Republican National Federation.
I was Chris Myers treasurer. I know Joanne, I know Doug, and I know Dennis. I did know the Noe’s when they were still in town.
I had given them all a second chance after learning of the Tom Noe scandal. It was after they continually ran the party as there own “play toy” that I grew concerned and thought it was time for a change.
I hope this helps, if you have any further questions please feel free to ask.
Thanks,
April 25th, 2008 at 3:37 pmJoe
megan -
April 25th, 2008 at 3:39 pmyou better calm down or you’ll be divorced before you are married.
Wondering if the Royal Barber III above is the same Royal Barber pictured going door-to-door with Jon Stainbrook in this Blade photo?
April 25th, 2008 at 4:32 pmRoyal, I personally don’t care if what happened in the car while parked was sexual or not, as I stated earlier no drugs were involved, neither person is married, they are both adults, etc.
However, it’s a given that when you have the media reporting foggy windows and a belt undone that there is going to be speculation. Quite a bit of speculation happens anytime something like this happens no matter the party affiliation, take the recent discussion related to Marc Dann’s office.
Jon can refuse to provide identification, however when you do that you can face charges. Which happened. It’s hard to bridge that as being something that is politically motivated. The whole situation happened as a result of their personal actions and decisions and was not some type of a set up.
April 25th, 2008 at 4:59 pmWow – whoever this guy is he’s sure generated some hard feelings (that was not intended as a pun, but it made me giggle so I’m leaving it) over time with Toledo folks.
Anybody want to tell me who this guy is, outside of his recent attempts at a Republican central committee take over? Or is that what caused the hard feelings?
April 25th, 2008 at 5:14 pmHaha! I am not that meghan, don’t know stain well enough to be his gilrfriend and not sure I would want to.
April 25th, 2008 at 5:15 pmOK, so Joe I didn’t know any of those things but they sound similar to what just happened with stain, a one time thing. How do they use the party as their personal play toy? Not sure I get that but you are entitled to your opinion. I just don’t think stain seems to be much of a leader, what does he do for a living now? All i really know of his work experience is from Frankies Bar on the eastside. What makes him qualified and has he made an effort to work with the current leadership to bring forth positive change? Everything he has done and said seems so negative i just wonder if he has tried to work this out.
Megan – I thought you were the megan from fred’s show, the one that is getting married.
Anyway, you sounded kinda snooty, just like him.
April 25th, 2008 at 5:23 pmi am kinda snotty for the record
April 25th, 2008 at 5:33 pmHmm. When I heard that the windows were fogged and Jon’s belt was undone, I assumed they meant his seat belt. And I thought the fogged windows were the natural result of people talking in a closed car in humid weather. If there was something sexual going on, seems like they would have at least pulled to the curb, not been four feet from it.
I don’t know what was going on in Jon Stainbrook’s mind, but I can say this: If I’d been approached by a campus cop on what was not readily known to be UT property, I too would have refused to cooperate. I would have called 911 on my cell to have Toledo police respond. I remember vividly Jeff Hodge’s MO when he was stalking women around the neighborhoods surrounding UT by making bogus traffic stops. For Melissa Herstrum, one of those bogus traffic stops ended in her death. We’ve also had media warnings recently about people claiming to be cops when they aren’t, and the outcome hasn’t been happy for their victims.
I have met Jon and had a few conversations with him. He’s unusual, bright, and full of energy. He may not fit everyone’s vision of what a political leader should be, but I do think his heart is in the right place and he could be good for the local GOP. He certainly knows how to organize the grass roots and I do believe he’s devoted to conservative values. My only reason for not wanting him in a leadership position is that I’m not a Republican and I’m worried he’d be successful in injecting new life in his party.
I don’t know if Stainbrook meant the whole incident was politically motivated, or if he meant the reaction is. From the tone of posts here, it appears to me that there is political motivation in some of the posts trashing Jon, and in one there appears to be a case of sour grapes on the part of a journalist who wanted to tell Stainbrook and Kidd’s story when it was actually their’s to tell in their own words and at the time of their choosing. Or at least that was the case until the Free Press decided to trample on their rights. How lucky that a pal of the Noes was the judge who heard the case when Stainbrook and Kidd tried to prevent publication of what was rightfully theirs.
Pam, I think Stainbrook is good-looking. He’s been well-groomed and nicely dressed the couple of times I’ve seen him in person and also the additional times I’ve seen him on TV. Maybe your politics are getting in the way of your eyesight.
April 25th, 2008 at 5:41 pmMegan -
you avoided the issue at hand. Are you the megan W. Smith that is ridiculed and belittled by fred on the show ?
The ‘w’ stands for ‘I don’t know any better that to tell fred to shut the fuck up when he talks down to me because I am so insecure that I don’t go out and get a better job someplace else’.
P.S. I said snooooty, but I think snotttty could be included as adjectives that accurately describe you.
April 25th, 2008 at 5:50 pm#56 reads as though Stainbrook himself wrote it.
There are no sour grapes on my part, and the name “Jon Stainbrook” hadn’t crossed my mind until the buffoon identified me in his TFP lawsuit as having something to do with the leak of his book abstract.
However, if Jon wants to take cheap shots at people, he’d better expect that they will respond in kind.
Also, as far as the “trample on their rights” claim about TFP, the readers here should know that both suits were thrown out, and that Joe Kidd was ordered to pay TFP and George Tanber over $6 grand in legal fees for the second bullshit lawsuit (Lucas County Common Pleas docket #G -4801 -CI-200706502-000).
Also: for the record, I am a freelance writer who has written for TFP in the past, though it’s been almost a year since I pitched them anything. I write from my own perspective, and neither shill for TFP nor speak on their behalf. Stainbrook’s decision to try and tie me into his lawsuit was the typical act of a guy who spends most of his time in court suing people he thinks he can get a few nickels from.
Just ask Staind, FOX Broadcasting, or any of the other people that Jon Stainbrook has sued.
My personal opinion of Stainbrook is that he’s a washed-up punk rocker who got lucky when Staind had a name close to his trademarked name, and beyond jobs like taking tickets at the door at Frankie’s and cleaning the pool at the yacht club, he’s done little else with his life.
Oh – I forgot that he used to frelance for the Glass Eye, a local music ‘zine, and JRB once threw him a bone and published Stainbrook’s interview with Scott Shriner, frontman for Weezer.
April 25th, 2008 at 6:55 pmYes, Mike, the lawsuits were thrown out by the Noes’ good buddy Judge Jensen. Someone should take a long, hard look at Jensen’s rulings and his failure to recuse himself.
Weren’t you trying to get Stainbrook’s and Kidd’s story while you were writing for the Free Press? Wasn’t that the venue where you hoped your story would appear?
I didn’t know that Kidd had to pay George Tanber anything. That’s disgusting. Almost as disgusting as Judge Jensen’s behavior in the case.
Just for the record, I am not Jon Stainbrook. I know him, but not well. I didn’t get the impression that he’s washed up. To me, he seemed creative and lively.
It’s odd that you see Jon’s losses in court as support for your negative view of him, while his wins were just the result of his having been undeservedly lucky.
As for what he has done with his life, I thought that Jon was recently a graduate student, like you.
April 25th, 2008 at 7:15 pmI have no idea what level of education Stainbrook has attained, nor do I care. My interest in matters related to Stainbrook is limited to his efforts to tie me to his leaked book abstract.
Never saw the document, nor do I care to. He seems to think that because I worked on the Wenzel-Noe story and TFP was interested in running the tale in 2005, that I am somehow a part of this big conspiracy to deny him his intellectual property.
Again: after late 2005, when the story got killed by TFP since neither Kidd nor Stainbrook would keep their word about going public, I have had nothing to do with Wenzelgate, Coingate, or Staingate. As far as I am concerned, the less I deal with the loopy Mr. Stainbrook, the better.
However, when I am dragged into legal matters, I care. When someone tries to take a cheap shot at me, I care, and I respond in kind.
If Jon Stainbrook wants to get into a pissing contest – either with Internet sock puppets or in any other forum – he’s better bring his hip waders, because I only stirred the surface of the slime in my earlier post.
And really: I have better things to do than waste my time feeding into the delusional political drama that Stainbrook thrives on.
And if you are not Stainbrook, you sure do buy into his conspiracy theories about the courts. Stainbrook and Kidd made the mistake of floating the abstract around Toledo instead of retaining a first-rate literary agent to pitch the idea to legitimate publishers. If there is any loss here, they are the ones responsible for it.
April 25th, 2008 at 7:43 pmOne eyed and Anonymous: Drive by Heatherdowns school after sundown. If you still don’t think the the building is not an obvious university building then you do belong with stain and his gang. The building has a at least 2 large signs (one on the building and a marque on the lawn) that are lit up at night. And if I was to choose somewhere to park, that wouldn’t be such a bad place, since it is an obvious university building which would likely be empty at midnight. I would just not have parked under the light and I would have gave my ID when told to.
April 25th, 2008 at 9:29 pmI have to say that I to would not have given up my paperwork either. I agree with RB that I had no knowledge that UT Police were nothing more the security people. I am thankful for the knowledge now but I can see RB’s point on that.
April 25th, 2008 at 10:37 pmFor the record, the honorable Judge James Jensen is a fair and honest judge. Anyone stating demeaning and idiotic comments about him either does not know his record or has other motives. Just because a judge rules against someone you idolize, does not mean the judge is somehow unqualified. In most civil cases there is a winner and a loser; unless the parties decide to settle. Usually, one side is pissed at somebody. It’s not the judge’s fault when someone files an idiotic lawsuit.
April 26th, 2008 at 9:40 amI second that Ron. Judge Jensen is one of the best. If you actually read the Judge’s decision, you will see that the lawsuit was completely bogus and totally was mishandled by the plaintiffs.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:09 amFor universal knowledge: there are fifteen university police departments in Ohio whose officers are certified and have full arrest powers under the Ohio Revised Code:
Bowling Green State University Police
Capital University Police
Cleveland State University Police
Hocking College Police
Kent State University Police
Miami University Police
Ohio State University Police
Ohio University Police
University of Akron Police
University of Cincinnati Police
University of Dayton Police
University of Toledo Police
Wright State University Police
Xavier University Police
Youngstown State University Police
But if you are looking for a quick way to know who is or is a cop, start with the vehicle. Certain light combinations can only be used by police and emergency personel under R.C. 4513.17, which limits the display of flashing lights and oscillating or rotating lights on motor vehicles:
(D) Except a person operating a public safety vehicle, as defined in division (E) of section 4511.01 of the Revised Code, or a school bus, no person shall operate, move, or park upon, or permit to stand within the right-of-way of any public street or highway any vehicle or equipment which is equipped with and displaying a flashing red or a flashing combination red and white light, or an oscillating or rotating red light, or a combination red and white oscillating or rotating light; and except a public law enforcement officer, or other person sworn to enforce the criminal and traffic laws of the state, operating a public safety vehicle when on duty, no person shall operate, move, or park upon, or permit to stand within the right-of-way of any street or highway any vehicle or equipment which is equipped with, or upon which is mounted, and displaying a flashing blue or a flashing combination blue and white light, or an oscillating or rotating blue light, or a combination blue and white oscillating or rotating light.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:15 amIt is really interesting that so many of you are getting worked up over a guy that no one has ever heard of.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:16 amA word of advice Out of The Loop, when an armed, fully equipped police officer(such as UT officers), driving a regular, fully equipped and marked police car(such as UT police cars), asks for ID, give it to him or her and ask questions later.
If Mr. Stainbrook had done this, none of us would being writing about this incident.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:22 amRon, with all due respect, your post indicates that you do not know much if anything about Judge Jensen’s role in the case. He may be a fine man in every other aspect of his life and when handling every other case that’s come before him, but in this instance he was disgraceful. It has nothing to do with idolizing those who lost. It has everything to do with Jensen himself.
Calling the lawsuit idiotic does not make it so. Had I been in Stainbrook’s and Kidd’s shoes, I would have filed a lawsuit as a necessary preliminary step in further litigation. Because prior restraint of the press is a non-starter, it had little hope of succeeding. But, the success of the next stage of litigation relied on that first filing being made. Despite the predictable outcome of the filing and Jensen’s ruling falling in line with that predictability, he should have recused himself from the case because of his relationship with the Noes, who were the subject of the book in question. However, it was Jensen’s later actions that disgraced him to the point where the buzz among some in the lawgal community included speculation that he might suffer professional repercussions.
May you never pour your energies into a project only to have it unveiled prematurely and without permission, thereby harming the marketability of your work product. If the Stainbrook and Kidd names were removed from this case and people were able to look at it based on just the facts alone without politics or personal relationships gumming up the works, I believe most people would be unlikely to make fun of the plaintiffs and more likely to support them.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:32 amYou are way off base Anonymous. I had an opportunity to observe some proceedings of the lawsuit, it was clearly a claim without merit.
As to your claim that the “buzz among some in the legal community included speculation that he might suffer professional repercussions”-nonsense. I suppose that “some” can me one, but there was no “buzz” or discussion whatsoever about this case! Frankly, no one even heard of this case until the newspaper article about how the plaintiffs mishandled the case.
April 26th, 2008 at 11:40 amAgreed, Jack. The only people who cared about this case were Kidd and Stainbrook, and those who had to fork out legal fees because they were sued (TFP, George Tanber, et al), or people like me, who got dragged into this because Joe and Jon once spoke to him about Wenzel.
And the passionate plea by Anonymous: “pour your energies into a project only to have it unveiled prematurely and without permission,” leads me to believe that the poster has a personal connection to the case.
Nothing is stopping (or ever has stopped) Kidd and Stainbrook from proceeding with shopping around a book to publishers. They should get an agent and get writing – if the book is worth publishing, someone will take a chance.
Unfortunately for Kidd and Stainbrook, such a book should have been on the bookshelves in 2004 or 2005, not 2008 or beyond. We are well into the next presidential cycle, and nobody will want to shell out $20 and read about the distant (in terms of news) past. Had they written a book while Coingate was still hot, they might be millionaires regardless of whether or not TFP, Salon.com, and Editor&Publisher wrote about it.
Heck – all that coverage would have been good publicity for them.
Instead, they decided to waste over two years filing lawsuits in Lucas County Common Pleas Court, and then crying about how crooked judges and sneaky publishers conspired to deny them the fruits of their labors.
Yawn.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:35 pmIf the plaintiffs felt so strongly about their case and if the case really had legal merit, they could have filed an appeal with the Sixth District Court of Appeals. Their silence on that matter speaks for itself.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:14 pmIt appears from some of the posters here, that the UT cops are going to be making more arrests in the future, since among a certain set of people, there is a pervasive feeling that the UT cops have limited jurisdiction. Oh well. More fines will be levied and paid until that particular ignorance is eradicated.
I will be following Mr Staindress’ court documents with some interest now. Given his statements to police, his further statements in court should prove even more amusing.
April 26th, 2008 at 10:15 pmHistorymike – I disagree. We who LIVE in south Toledo care that this happened.
If UT security officers do plan repeat performances in south Toledo and think they can just drive over and start asking for folks’ “papers” without showing a warrant, due or probable cause, they’re going to run into a large and memorable problem. Namely – me. But that’s ok. Everybody needs at least one really good story to tell at the nursing home
Ha. Happy to oblige pals.
Any meandering UT security officers would be well advised to eat their Wheaties and bring their friends if they’d like to drive over and start demanding people ’show their papers’ (heil) in South Toledo.
Strangely – many of us in the south end of Toledo happen to have read the Bill of Rights.
If you stop me and ask me for my ‘papers’, prepare yourself to be treated as a Nazi. You’ve earned it. So no whining.
April 27th, 2008 at 2:04 amKate, they didn’t just “drive over” they were patrolling what the University of Toledo owns, the former school. It’s their job to patrol what happens on and in front of University property.
April 27th, 2008 at 4:38 amKateb: I was referring to the TFP-Stainbrook lawsuit, not this current case.
But, as certified peace officers in the state of Ohio, UT police are fully within the law to stop vehicles or suspicious persons anywhere in the normal course of their duty.
UT police officers frequently patrol areas off University property to monitor streets where UT students are known to throw parties, and they have been known to make arrests or assist in investigations in other areas in and around the main campus, the Scott Park campus, and the medical center campus.
Now, as far as Kateb’s libertarianesque displeasure with police agencies and the Fourth Amendment: while I sympathize and bemoan the reduced state of American liberty, the law is the law. It is better to fight encroachments on liberty through the ballot box, the legislative process, or the courts than it is to waste your time fighting with the police at a traffic stop. All you’ll end up doing is joining Jon Stainbrook at Toledo Municipal Court paying expensive tickets.
I had one run-in with the police when I was much younger and cockier in which I tried to assert my rights after getting pulled over for an expired tag in Michigan. The long and short of it? My decision to argue with the police ended with my car getting towed, whereas if I had played nice, they probably would have let me go with a warning or a ticket.
April 27th, 2008 at 7:57 amCorrect historymike. Anyone who decides to argue jurisdiction with a police officer at night out on the street is an idiot–or worse. Make those arguments in Court.
April 27th, 2008 at 8:13 amThe references to Nazi this or Nazi are interesting.
What with Holocaust remembrance day coming up.
A police officer, who most hold in high esteem, preforms a function.
To preserve the peace and keep us safe.
There has to be some reason or suspicion for the stop to be made, not merely a show me your papers.
The Bill of Rights sets out our rights and freedoms, yes, maybe we need a Bill Of Responsibilities, also.
One that lays out what we should do and when we fail to do so, what we can expect in return.
Maybe consider the comment of this person;
“IS OUR President allowed to empower himself as dictator? Should he be allowed to ban or suspend our basic Rule of Law? If any such events ever took place in America, it would be very unjust and a violation of our Constitution. The “Rule of Law” is our basic system of self-government and a legal system based on the idea that no one person or institution is above the law.”
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080427/OPINION04/804270307
April 27th, 2008 at 8:28 amSounds to me that Anonymous is no other that Joe Kidd himself, but leaves me to wonder why he isn’t using his normal alias KevinHelpus. Or maybe it’s Stainbrooks other girlfriend, Kelly.
April 27th, 2008 at 12:15 pmJump to wild conclusions much?
I’m not Jon. I’m not Joe. I’m not Kelly. I’m not Meghan. I’m not involved in the lawsuit. I have followed the case with interest. Apparently others here have, also. My interest is in the copyright and intellectual property aspects of the case, but it looks like others are more concerned with the politics and personalities. I doubt I would agree with either man’s politics, but I do care about the legal issues their case raised.
I wonder why it’s so difficult for some to understand that a person can observe what happened to Stainbrook and Kidd and side with them without having some vested interest in the case. Legally, it’s not even a close call. They were wronged.
April 27th, 2008 at 4:34 pmI wouldn’t want to test this theory in court – but I believe I have a right to presume, unless it is clearly marked as University of Toledo property, that a UT officer would be outside his patrol area.
The reason I believe this and I’d LOVE to be able to remember the name of the case, is a person impersonating a police officer raped quite a few women over several years before he was caught. Had a bubble gum machine, uniform – the whole enchilada.
I’ve taught my daughter and I will do the same. Unless you can show me a badge (and one that makes any kind of rational sense – which under these circumstances I would not have felt a UT officer should be asking for id and would call the police also) from the appropriate department – I’m not opening the window and I’m not doing anything other than calling 911.
April 27th, 2008 at 4:42 pmOh – p.s. I’ve never met this guy or the Kidd guy. I’m late to the game and it’s very interesting to see the relationships. Stainbrook has generated some really hard feelings out of some normally gentle people (imo).
But I take it very seriously, how the police conduct themselves and the Bill of Rights. If we don’t maintain our rights, no one else will do it for us.
April 27th, 2008 at 4:44 pmKateb, you don’t have to go very far back in history for a similar case:
April 27th, 2008 at 4:59 pmhttp://www.wtol.com/Global/story.asp?S=8164697
Kateb, the UT police officer wear uniforms, badges and equipment just like any other police officer. Their cars are marked and equipment like every other department’s cars.
April 27th, 2008 at 5:06 pmTrue, on rare occasions thugs and rapists are actual police officers, and sometimes thugs and rapists pretend to be police officers. However, thugs and rapists can be bakers, lawyers, mechanics, or even pizza delivery drivers, too.
However, pretend cops do not typically drive around in marked, readily-identifiable police vehicles with restricted emergency lightbars, and the cops-who-go-bad usually do so on their off time, since they are highly visible with their on-duty uniform, numbered badge, and patrol car.
The only time I would even consider not pulling over is if a someone in an unmarked car pulled up waving a badge, and I would be calling 911 to make sure that it was legit before I pulled over and opened up my car.
And Kateb: would you also refuse to pull over for a sheriff’s deputy, state trooper, or the FBI if you made the determination that they were “outside their jurisdiction?” Not to be giving you a hard time, but this sounds like a problem waiting to happen. If you have concerns, you can always put 911 on your speed dial and have finger poised on “SEND.”
April 27th, 2008 at 5:14 pmI have said some time ago, that this stain character looks creepy and not trustworthy. Some others, including Lisa don’t see that. But apparently the ladies like that trait in a guy. Maybe the young lady (15 years younger) is just pleased to be with a “bigwig” and working the pen is pleasing to her. I must admit that this stain dude is doing something right. I am envious of the guy, and I bet most are. If he is as hot as the girls think he probably gets his carrot stroked by young girls all the time.
You reckon?
April 27th, 2008 at 8:56 pmKateb, If you have read all the postings, you would have read a couple of my postings saying that the building is fully marked as a University building. Stop and read everything before sticking your foot in your mouth. Or drive by the building yourself.
Also, if you think that an officer is out of their jurisdiction, it is far better to place nice on the street. In stains case, they probably would be ask to get going and have a safe night. But if a jurisdiction case goes to court, if you played nice, that officer might not be there argue against your case which would then have the case thrown-out.
April 28th, 2008 at 12:26 pmanonymous, I find it interesting you are interested in the Stain-Kidd case. Since you are neither Jon or Joe, you are also someone who was in a closet when coingate truly broke. I myself could easily compose a book that would be truly close to the truth and I never had the chance to see their proposal. The big problem with their case is that first: they already talked to historymike in the beginning so he got information from them regarding what might be in a book about coingate. Second: there are a few if not many individuals who knew a lot of the details regarding coingate. Mostly cause Jon and Joe are lousy about playing the deepthroat role.
April 28th, 2008 at 12:35 pmOh Doug – I think that was cute. IF you had read my posting (prior to your chastising me for not reading yours) you’d see I had stated I was planning to drive by the location to check for postings myself.
So we’re both bad
April 28th, 2008 at 12:36 pmHaving asked around about the Stainbrook fellow – I do indeed find that he is not well liked. As a fly on the wall who knows NONE of the involved parties – I observe:
1. This situation, I’m going to call it ‘bucklegate’, is in fact a situation that a rational mind would conclude would never have been a public incident were it not for the genuine dislike so many harbor for this individual. I hope he takes a clue from it and spends some time in introspection. Whatever it is he’s doing, he’s the commonality.
2. People dislike this guy to such a degree that anyone who shows any appearance of disagreeing with them aggravates them and puts them on the offensive.
And this is the guy who’s making a play for the local Republican committee chair. Sad, just sad.
April 28th, 2008 at 12:41 pmKateb, the dislike you’re seeing is from those who have political differences with Stainbrook. I didn’t meet him in an environment related to politics, so I didn’t have that baggage. I like him. Having said that, I also recognize that not everyone in the world will like him, just as not everyone in the world will like anyone. Jon is an unusual person, and won’t be everyone’s cup of tea. Still, I think he has proven himself to be a powerful force politically. He has even recruited me from time to time to help with political projects and I have had to remind him that I am not a Republican. I doubt he has given up yet when it comes to converting me.
The Republican committee chairman who’s good at organzing the grassroots might be more effective than one who’s beloved by one and all. How many of us have had bosses we didn’t like, but who did a great job with the tasks they were given? I don’t know if Jon would be good in the position, but doesn’t it seem like the party needs a change at the top and he’s the only one who’s showing the gumption to do something about it? I think that counts for something.
Doug, I wasn’t “in the closet” as Coingate broke, whatever that means. I learned about it in the Blade, just as most other people in our community did. I didn’t know the Noes other than having met Tom once in a non-political setting. I spoke with him for about 30 seconds and found him to be pleasant. This was years prior to Coingate.
Of course many people could tell the Coingate story, and they could do so from any number of perspectives. But, Stainbrook and Kidd are the owners of their own personal story, not the Coingate story, and it is theirs to tell. It does not belong to TFP, just as their book proposal was not TFP’s property. TFP was out of bounds when they published pieces of it.
Flip this story to fiction and see if you can better understand the legal issue. Had TFP published without permission an author’s proposal for a novel, revealing the plot line, wouldn’t you see how that would damage the author’s ability to market the book? It’s no different when it comes to someone writing what is essentially a memoir.
I may be wrong, but I was under the impression from past posts elsewhere by Historymike that he was working on the Wenzel story and that he’d had input from either Stainbrook or Kidd, or maybe both. That’s not surprising because, according to what I’ve read elsewhere, Stainbrook made extensive efforts to bring the Wenzel story to light and was ignored for a long time. I don’t know this, but my guess is that about the time Mike was going to write about it and wanted the gentlemen to go on the record, they were already working with the Blade and were reserving their on-the-record remarks for them. If my guess is correct, it makes sense to me that they would have made the choice they did. If I were looking for justice in the Wenzel situation, I would have wanted the paper with the largest circulation to have the story and I would have known that I would need to control my on-the-record remarks when speaking to non-Blade media people in order to keep the Blade committed to the story.
April 28th, 2008 at 1:35 pmIt is sad Kateb. The issue that some people have with him (maybe most) is his arrogance in thinking he should or could be the leader of the Lucas County Republicans. Since the ninety’s when he was fired from the (I believe the auditors office, ran by Kaczala) he has had a personal vendetta against the bigwigs of the party. But since then, he has not done anything to better himself to put him in a position for his revenge. Instead, he is trying to bully his way into leadership. Not because he deserves it, because thats all he can do. He went out and recruited hundred plus individuals to sit on the central committee so they could possibly vote for him. However, these individuals do not resemble traditional republicans. Because of the stereotype of republicans, the party needs active people with deep pockets. This is because candidates don’t get union endorsements and other financial backing like democrats, so candidates need the support of the party and its members.
The arrogance or ignorance of Jon is that if he takes control, the money people will have little respect for him. He is uneducated (I don’t think he has a college degree but I could be wrong), doesn’t own a business, not even a house. He is a “singer” and he has work at various lackluster jobs. What reason would anybody with a lot of money and would like to help the GOP gain political strength in NW Ohio want to give their money to someone like that. They did it once, Tom Noe, and if you think Coingate was a bad thing then you would probably look at having Jon as Chairman as a future Coingate waiting to happen. Maybe he will bank on his books or songs to make Millions of dollars.
The big picture is, if Jon runs the party, there will be no party to fight for political fairness. And the Dems would truly have Toledo to do with what it wants, and a one party system is never good.
April 28th, 2008 at 1:40 pmDoug, the last I heard Jon was in graduate school. He may have finished that degree by now, and the last I heard he had exactly the kind of deep pockets you seem to think are good for the party. From what I’ve observed about him, it’s a mistake to under-estimate him. Those who do often end up bitten in the butt. Since he was one of the guys who exposed Coingate, it’s surprises me that you are predicting he’d bring on another Coingate. I wonder what makes you think that.
You also say the next chairman should be “active.” Who can possibly think that Jon hasn’t been active? You yourself pointed out how many people he signed up. Did anyone else do as much?
Do you think it’s good for the party’s future to reject people who do not fit the stereotype of what a Republican is? I’ve never been a fan of stagnation so I have to think that injecting new life in the local party can only benefit the GOP, though it may not benefit the old guard that wants to stay stuck in same old way of doing things. That hasn’t worked out too well for the GOP in Lucas County up to now. Stainbrook may be the very person the party needs now.
Why did he get fired by the auditor? Was it because the auditor wanted to make room at the office for relatives? As I recall, nepotism was a bit of problem when Larry was in office.
April 28th, 2008 at 5:43 pmFrom how I understood it, Joe Kidd is the one who states he informed the authorities about Noe, at least that’s how it’s been reported.
It’s also interesting to point out in 2006 Jon stated he wanted to be chair of the Lucas County Republican Party.
I don’t think Jon left the Auditor’s office because of neptoism, it was because Jon ran against him and made accusations as to how Kaczala ran the office.
Unless Jon is planning to try to figure out a way to self fund the party and future candidates that’s been one of the main concerns I’ve heard expressed about him, will mainstream republicans who currently donate to keep the party in existance continue to donate. While many people make fun of the “country club set” they are the ones who have kept the party functioning in Lucas County. Without their support it could be difficult and there are many who feel that Stainbrook won’t be able to work with them and that they will not be able to work with him.
There’s a long history with some of the players, and some pretty hard feelings. Republicans can’t afford to have an A and a B team, but that’s what many fear would happen. Possible or just the normal fear associated with any change? That could be debated.
April 28th, 2008 at 6:33 pmDoug and Lisa – thanks for the input. Doug, that’s a better explanation and further out than anyone else was willing to go to help me understand.
And Lisa – I don’t think the Republicans that are the old guard would support these changes. Just a hunch.
April 28th, 2008 at 6:37 pmKate, I don’t disagree but if a majority of elected Republicans decide they want change? Then it will be up to those who disagree to either join or walk away for the time being.
April 28th, 2008 at 6:45 pmI agree that Stainbrook is an excellent grassroots organizer, and that he has carried a lot of water for a lot of people over the years.
IMHO, Jon’s troubles stem from his seeming inability to schmooze and get along with powerful people. When he carries a grudge, he carries it for a looooong time. I’m not going to disclose specific examples, since I will stick to my word that I won’t disclose the things Jon told me in 2005, but I got the sense that he has a lot of powerful GOP enemies, and this could definitely work against him as chair.
He reminds me of local Democratic operative Dominic Montalto in his street-level work and willingness to do what needed to get done, especially the bare knuckles, quasi-legal crap that keeps a party going when money is tight. However, unlike Dom, Jon Stainbrook does not seem to work the system to his benefit, and I can’t name a single major GOP figure on the local scene (save the isolated Joe Kidd) who would work with Stainbrook.
I have one memory from the mid-1990s about Stainbrook that is worth repeating. I bought a table at a fundraiser for a GOP candidate for Toledo City Council (10 tickets at $20 each) back when I owned a business, had disposable cash up the yazoo, and was at least a nominal Jack Kemp Republican. It was at the old Gladieux on Laskey, and there were the usual suspects hobnobbing around in business attire.
In walks Stainbrook, resplendent in a red-white-and-blue striped jacket, with one of those long blond “hair-metal-band” hairdos, looking like a guy from Flock of Seagulls or something. Yes, he is a true individualist and all, but there is something to be said for making an effort to fit in to your surroundings.
At the time Stainbrook would have been in his thirties, and I heard at lot of muffled comments about how goofy Jon looked. Again, people can do their own thang to their hearts’ content, but if I walked into church with a Batman costume on, I’m sure I would get a similar response.
April 28th, 2008 at 7:06 pmAccording the articles published in the Blade, Joe Kidd had no involvement in Coingate. He was involved only in the Federal charges. Those charges were related to illegal campaign contributions.
Having just reread all of the Blade stories, I noticed that Mr. Stainbrook’s is never mentioned.
April 28th, 2008 at 8:18 pmJack, my understanding is that Kidd told the prosecutors and Wenzel about the illegal fundraising and Stainbrook told various people about Wenzel’s conflicts of interest. Although Coingate wasn’t about the fundraising, the fundraising revelations led to the Coingate investigation.
Lisa, I’ve read posts suggesting that Stainbrook is a good friend of John Block’s. I was under the impression that Block is both rich and powerful, so while Stainbrook may not be best buds with the typical country club set, he may have friends in higher places than his enemies wish to admit. I don’t disagree with you about who has held the local GOP together in the past. But, isn’t it obvious that the party has never been very successful in Lucas County? It may be that the GOP needs to reach out to a broader, less well-heeled audience. That may be the only way they can put more of their candidates in office.
Historymike, I’ve not been aware of Stainbrook long enough to have seen him during his more colorful days. Anytime I’ve seen him, he’s been in conservative business attire and his hair has been trim and short. Could it be he’s now making that effort to fit in?
April 28th, 2008 at 10:23 pmAnonymous, to fill you in on Coingate, it is my impression that Jon was not living in Toledo at the time it truly broke. I have a friend who is a friend of Jon’s and during the entire 2004-2005 time period, every time my friend made reference to Jon, it was that “My friend, Jon, who is in Cleveland (maybe Akron, I’m not quite sure).” so it would be impressive for him to be a true part of the Coingate/Wenzel story.
And yes, it was cause of Kidd that the fundraising allegations got started and the state dems pushed it into coingate.
And no, I am not scared about getting on his bad side. He has not bitten any butt (except maybe, nah I won’t go there). Since his firing from the auditor’s office he has had an unsuccessful runs against Kaczala, and an unsuccessful run for City Council. Each time challenging the local GOP and losing.
And as for the fact him and Block might be friends, that doesn’t mean Block is ready to become a Republican if Jon became GOP chair. No, John Block is so liberal one would only choke on their dinner. Which is another point to be made, if Jon and John are close friends, what does that mean for the GOP? What change will Stain bring? Jon has rarely shown conservative values that the Republicans are known for. He might believe in values but I have yet to see it. And like Mike said, he can’t schmooze with the people with power both here and at the state level. So what good would he be if he can only get volunteers out for events. He often struggles with that as well. He only got the 100 plus people cause he talked to them in the bars and convinced them sign some papers. Will they show up for the important meeting.
April 28th, 2008 at 11:36 pmDoug, judging from the preview of tomorrow’s Blade stories aired on Channel 13 tonight, I’d say one GOP office holder got bitten on the butt pretty badly by Jon in court today. Looks like she was just one more person who under-estimated him.
In the few conversations I’ve had with Stainbrook, I’ve heard him voice GOP values and also Christian values. His faith appears to be very important to him.
I don’t know anything about his ability to schmooze nor do I know how important that ability is in a chairman. However, I do think motivating volunteers is a good thing. Didn’t he also round up people to work at the polls for pay? I have a vague memory of having read that he did that at a time when workers were hard to find. Maybe I’m confusing him with someone else.
I have no idea if the people he signed up will show up for the meeting. If I had my way, no Republicans would show up for any meetings, ever. I like having the Dems in control. But, what if they do show up? Will that change your view of his efforts to get them involved?
I also do not know where Jon was living when Coingate broke, but I think it’s fairly well-known that he did tell several people in the media about Wenzel. It was not Democrats who turned the fundraising investigation into Coingate. It was state and federal investigators who did that. Not everything is about politics.
April 29th, 2008 at 12:14 amNice anonymous, but I still think you are barking up a tree that you truly know nothing about. It is interesting that everyone is identifying Joanne Wack is an office holder. She is not an office holder, she is an employee of the party and serves at the will of the Chairman and the party. Second, what does a 20 year old felony have to do with the process of elections when she is not employed by the Board of Elections. She might be slightly embarrassed by her past, but we all have things in the past that we are embarrassed about. (Ask Jon about his great photography skills he demonstrated in the nineties with with members of the female persuasion or maybe he is proud of that). And Joanne will not be losing her job for that little secret coming out. In fact, many supporters of Joanne now see how petty Stainbrook is by attacking her past. Its like what my mother always told me, “when people have to attack you personally it means they have no other means to win the argument and you should not stoop to the same level.” (Oops mom, I should have listened to your advice before writing this. lol)
And maybe your right about him having money, he is sure spending a ton of money on legal cost just to try and get his people into the central committee. He is trying way to hard for this chairmanship. He is worst then Clemens taking steroids, winning the chairmanship in courtrooms and in bars (where he recruited some individuals) is not the sign of a leader. If he truly was a Republican, he would have found a better way to get political strength.
As for him recruiting poll workers: I was told by people at the Board of Elections that Jon recruited many workers and that his group needed a training session for just them. When it came to training day a very small percentage of that group showed up. Which still left the BOE struggling to fill the positions.
As for coingate, the dems and the Blade truly pushed it into coingate, the federal investigation only brought up allegations and needed a push that the Blade and Dems provided. And no I am not taking a political stand, as everything played out, it was appropriate for the Dems to push for a deep investigation into the BWC.
As for the Wenzel story, all well known republicans knew he was a Republican and that the Noe’s got Wenzel into some rooms just being a reporter wouldn’t. But as for him being payed by the Noe’s is so far from the truth. And if he was not reporting on the Noe scandal back when Kidd supposedly contacted him, it could be that he knew that Kidd was disgruntled towards the Noe’s and that maybe had been skeptical towards the source. And Wenzel left the Blade as coingate began. Which would be the time I thought Jon Stainbrook was living elsewhere then in Lucas County.
April 29th, 2008 at 8:31 pmDoug, being disgruntled does not make a person a liar. If a reporter is skeptical, that should not keep him from looking into the matter when such serious accusations are raised.
I was told that Wenzel intended to go into business with Mrs. Noe in a political communication firm but Coingate’s gaining steam messed up those plans. That information may or may not be true (I have no way of knowing), but if you check the Secretary of State filings you’ll see that Mrs. Noe filed for an LLC on April 8, 2005, using the Catawba Island address. Wenzel left the Blade May 13, 2005, and in a few days was working on Jean Schmidt’s campaign. In other words, he was in the political communications business. Mrs. Noe’s LLC was for a communications firm.
Do you really believe the only reason the feds conducted the Coingate investigation is because of pressure from the Blade and the Dems? You don’t think that the coins reported missing from Tom’s business caused them to look at Noe’s activities? You think they would have just ignored the information that was surfacing and said, “We’ll sit on this unless the Democrats or the Blade tell us it needs to be investigated”? I give the feds credit for being a bit more autonomous than that.
Ms. Wack’s felony conviction may have been twenty years ago, but her lie under oath is only about one day old. It’s interesting that the GOP doesn’t see that as a problem, yet it’s really terrible that Stainbrook recruited several poll workers, not all of whom showed up for training. See why I’m a Democrat? We’d be celebrating the ones who did show up.
April 29th, 2008 at 11:10 pmAnonymous, for someone who is only interested in Stainbrook’s legal case with TFP and ownership of material, you sure do know a whole lot. It is not surprising you defend Stainbrook being a democrat. But one of my many points is that Jon resembles a democrat and not a republican. Look at the A & B teams in the local democrat party. I know the republicans will only have one team, and that team will be the team that keeps a republican in as president. It will also be a party not lead by a lawsuit happy political hack.
As for Noe, I believe some of her plans with her communications business wasn’t just to give Wenzel a job. I believe she had plans for her own political career to begin. As for hiring Wenzel, he has a lot of great experience in the area of politics. A great mind. And I believe he has a pretty good job right now with a big political communications firm.
Maybe Kidd wasn’t a liar, but was Wenzel charged with covering anything up. No! Just cause he didn’t investigate a story that happened during the middle of a heavy presidential campaign that saw Northwest Ohio in the middle of the fight, doesn’t mean he was in a cover-up. There was a lot of things to cover in the 2004 campaign.
And yes the investigation did discover the wrong-doings of Tom Noe, but would it have been coingate if not for the Blade and Democrats.
Another about Stainbrook and the book deal. I read what the TFP had published that he didn’t want them to. The fact that in the proposal they talk that Karl Rove stole the election. That tells me again that he has no Republican values. And saying that the Wenzel cover-up protected Bush in his reelection that Kidd and Stainbrook could have hindered. He would probably have been excited to see Kerry win and probably voted for him. To me, that is not a Republican. He might be think he is a Republican, but he isn’t.
As for the lie in court, didn’t Bill Clinton lie under oath. Wait, I’m sorry he didn’t have sex with her cause he received oral pleasure. I’m sure that many people have lied on the stand because they don’t remember everything in their lives. Its pretty hard for some people to even remember things they did yesterday when they are busy running an organization. Even if it was a felony, I’m sure she has paid her restitution and it doesn’t linger in her memory everyday. And the issue she was on the stand for was regarding whether or not someone is a valid member of the Republican Central Committee. This wasn’t a criminal case and she wasn’t on trial.
April 30th, 2008 at 1:33 amThe players involved in the famous Pulitizer letter popped up in the TFP book proposal drama, and that’s how I became familiar with the accusations against Wenzel. You make a lot of excuses for Mr. Wenzel’s failure to do his job, but they don’t match his own excuse.
Bill Clinton has nothing to do with Joanne Wack, but that was a nice try. Today’s editorial in the Blade about perjury sums up my beliefs about the matter. Ms. Wack was not suffering from a memory lapse. She made that clear when explaining why she lied. The excuses you offer regarding her behavior hold about as much water as those you offer up on behalf of Mr. Wenzel.
As I’ve said before, I do not know Stainbrook well. It’s a superficial familiarity. For all I know, he secretly campaigned for John Kerry. However, from what I have personally heard come out of Jon Stainbrook’s mouth, he’s 100% Republican. I never heard him voice a single political view or support for any political candidate that I could agree with. I would call him a rabid Republican. It strikes me as silly to even try to paint him as a Democrat. I’d also like to remind you that being a Democrat is a good thing, so if you want to insult Stainbrook you should find another label to throw at him.
April 30th, 2008 at 8:57 amAnonymous, as for Wenzel’s excuse, I have yet to find a published copy of why he didn’t investigate or any proof that he had prior knowledge of the case. Tell me where I can find this published document for myself to read and I will read it. As I read through the article, there were allegations he did not dig into some stories as much as he should have but none directly relating to Tom Noe and Coingate.
Bill Clinton still told a lie under oath. The difference between him and Joanne is that Joanne wasn’t under investigation herself. As for the the letter to the editor: the court proceedings are not a criminal matter and there was no prosecutor on the courtroom. At that moment, it is the attorney’s job to prove the perjury and the judge to determine the actions at that time. Because the lie was recanted, the perjury is vacated and such the proceedings continued on. This is common in most courtrooms, if you recant the lie on the stand, the perjury is then vacated.
Unlike Kwammi, with the fact he never recanted his testimony in court, the perjury case stands. Amazing how people assume how the court should do its job.
April 30th, 2008 at 1:21 pmDoug, it’s not difficult to find information about Wenzel and who told him what and when they told him. Google is your friend. It’s how I’ve gotten whatever information I have about him. He has said he did give the Blade editors the info, but they deny it. He has also said something to the effect that he didn’t take the stories seriously. Fine. But, when you look at his relationship with the Noes (for example, Bernadette singing his praises at the Lincoln Day Dinner the year Coingate broke; google it) and his obvious political affiliation, it’s not unreasonable to guess at what his real motivation was for staying silent and to reach the conclusion he was protecting his friends. Can I know that for absolute certain? No. I can only speculate, but I believe it to be a logical speculation.
You can twist Joanne Wack’s perjury every which way, but it still comes down to the fact she lied under oath. What incentive is there for people to tell the truth if they are immediately given the opportunity to do a make-good? Won’t people take their chances with a lie in our local court system, then clean up the mess if they get caught? It appears that Ms. Wack has had a lot of make-goods in her life. The Blade detailed today a number of times she was saved by making restitution in cases where she wrote bad checks and/or committed forgery. That was quite a long list of people who’d been ripped off by her. That they were eventually made whole again does not negate the fact that she did what she did. I looked up some of those charges and saw that she even blew off going to court and warrants had to be issued. She apparently does not have much respect for the justice system. If the GOP wants her, great, but isn’t it pathetic that in pointing out why they’re okay with keeping her employed, it has to be said that she doesn’t handle their money (see today’s Blade)? What a ringing endorsement for how much they trust her.
Looks like you and I are the only ones interested in this topic, so maybe we should give it a rest for the sake of everyone else’s patience. I doubt either of us can persuade the other to cross over to our point of view, so all we’re doing is beating a dead horse.
April 30th, 2008 at 2:06 pmJust one final note. Look in the clerk of courts records for very similar problems with Stainbrook. He also has lawsuits against him for similar charges. And as for Joanne not handling the money, she is not legally responsible for the money. It is the treasurer of the Executive committee of the Party that has to answer to the party and to election officials regarding that fact. That is always the case including with the local Democrat part. So it is not because of her background that she doesn’t handle the money, it is not her JOB.
April 30th, 2008 at 3:02 pmI understand it’s not her job, yet the party official found it necessary to mention she doesn’t handle the money. The comment indicates that would be area of concern if she were handling it. Otherwise, there was no reason to mention it as far as I can determine.
I’ll check the clerk of court records.
Thanks for the polite discussion, Doug. Maybe we’ll meet again on another thread. I look forward to it. You’ve been a genuine gentleman. I appreciate it.
April 30th, 2008 at 3:17 pmGee, look what happens when you Google your name – The mysterious GuestZero wanted to draft me for chairman? [post # 44 this thread]
Hey, sorry I was a Hussarian officer in Rush’s “Operation Chaos” Calvary. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Hussars#Tactics
Now a temporary member of the Lucas County Democrat “D” team. legality would prevent me from any official Republican activity at least for a couple years.
Just biding my time operating polishtoledo.com and it’s associated blog. Pestering our Senators and Representative in Congress about getting America back on its rightful track and enjoying an occasional chilled Zubrówka or one of 11 other Polish imports straight out of the freezer.
Any hardcore, no nonsense, private property rights, antisocialist, Lech Walesa or Ayn Rand types are more than welcome to the bar at Dom Kutylowski to lift a traditional vodka flute of Polish Bison Grass Infused Spirits now legal in the alcohol control state of Ohio due to my relentless petition. Dancing girls on Thursdays.
I’m really not that hard to find just call my appointment secretary at 206-203-1049.
As for the current state of LCRP – Glupszy niz ustawa przewiduje! Jebie jakby małpe rozdarł.
As for the previous state of LCRP – Glupszy niz ustawa przewiduje! Jebie jak z murzyńskiej chaty.
June 26th, 2008 at 6:53 pm